A Beautiful Combination

[Fade the Butcher]

Another blow to subjectivism.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1522192/posts

Beauty, as it turns out, isn't skin deep. A study at the University of St. Andrews in Fife, Scotland, has shown that attractiveness in females relates to the hormonal composition of blood.

Researchers found that men tend to be attracted to women who have high levels of estrogen, a naturally occurring sex hormone linked to fertility. The report also found that women with high estrogen levels had more feminine features, such as bigger eyes, fuller lips and smoother skin.

The researchers photographed 59 women between 18 and 25, who were wearing no makeup, and took a urine sample from each subject for hormone analysis. A group of men then rated the women in the photographs for health, femininity and attractiveness. . .

[jcs]

Another blow to subjectivism.
You mean 'relativism,' right? Subject-ive implies something which is contrasted to the object-ive, and wholly dependent upon the latter as the latter is dependent upon the former. This beauty is still perceived by a subject, and is still a 'subjective' opinion even if based upon 'objective' traits. As contrasted to pure relativism, there is a universal 'language' of beauty--which still has a strongly subjective thing going on.

(and, of course, pure subjectivism is as untenable as pure objectivism; though this does not do away with a certain degree of solipsism which still holds that 'the world is my representation'--in fact, this degree of solipsism naturally goes hand-in-hand with the subject/object dichotomy)

[Fade the Butcher]

You mean 'relativism,' right?

No.

BTW:

[Fade the Butcher]

You mean 'relativism,' right?

No.

Note: The character limit needs to be adjusted.

[Jimbo Gomez]

No.

Note: The character limit needs to be adjusted.

You do it, I'm too lazy right now. I may do it tonight though.

[jcs]

No.
As explained, calling it 'subjectivism' makes no sense.

[Banat]

Beauty, as it turns out, isn't skin deep. A study at the University of St. Andrews in Fife, Scotland, has shown that attractiveness in females relates to the hormonal composition of blood.

Beauty here seems to be equated with attractiveness, although probably not intentionally. Hormones do affect attractiveness but beauty is more a thing of proportion and symmetry.

[Excorcism]

Beauty here seems to be equated with attractiveness, although probably not intentionally. Hormones do affect attractiveness but beauty is more a thing of proportion and symmetry.

well are you talking about romantic or aesthetic beauty?

[Banat]

well are you talking about romantic or aesthetic beauty?

Beauty simply as 'the main feature of what we call beautiful'.

BTW, what would 'romantic beauty' and 'aesthetic' one mean?

[Kodos]

Subjectivism means essentially that you believe your own mind on some level controls reality around you... im not really sure how this proves or disproves that theory of reality.


Beauty, as it turns out, isn't skin deep. A study at the University of St. Andrews in Fife, Scotland, has shown that attractiveness in females relates to the hormonal composition of blood.

Researchers found that men tend to be attracted to women who have high levels of estrogen, a naturally occurring sex hormone linked to fertility. The report also found that women with high estrogen levels had more feminine features, such as bigger eyes, fuller lips and smoother skin.

Of course most men like women with more feminine features and of course female hormone will tend to promote them.

[jcs]

Subjectivism means essentially that you believe your own mind on some level controls reality around you... im not really sure how this proves or disproves that theory of reality.
sub·jec·tiv·ism Pronunciation Key (sb-jkt-vzm)
n.
1. The quality of being subjective.
2.
a. The doctrine that all knowledge is restricted to the conscious self and its sensory states.
b. A theory or doctrine that emphasizes the subjective elements in experience.
3. Any of various theories holding that the only valid standard of judgment is that of the individual. For example, ethical subjectivism holds that individual conscience is the only appropriate standard for moral judgment.

I think Fade is refering to the third position, applied to beauty. 'Eye of the beholder'-type subjectivism. Of course, beauty is something that can be experienced only by the knowing-subject, so it is subjective (in fact, it is the object of the subject's knowing in this instance).

What this discovery does away with is a pure no. 3, but that number 3 could not exist purely without an object for its subject. So, more importantly, it does away with relativism.

[Excorcism]

Beauty simply as 'the main feature of what we call beautiful'.

BTW, what would 'romantic beauty' and 'aesthetic' one mean?

Well when you speak of beauty in a form of symmetry, I call that mainly aesthetic, but beauty related to hormones is something I would call romantically related.

[Banat]

Well when you speak of beauty in a form of symmetry, I call that mainly aesthetic, but beauty related to hormones is something I would call romantically related.

Intuitively I assumed that you had that in mind. But isn't it better to call that 'romantic beauty' attractiveness. Not all attractive women are necessarily beautiful, and it is highly possible for an attractive woman to be described as 'nice' or ordinary looking, even to have some non-beautiful features.

[Excorcism]

Intuitively I assumed that you had that in mind. But isn't it better to call that 'romantic beauty' attractiveness. Not all attractive women are necessarily beautiful, and it is highly possible for an attractive woman to be described as 'nice' or ordinary looking, even to have some non-beautiful features.

hmm, fair enough.