Blair and Hain face fierce backlash over amnesty for 150 IRA fugitives

[Felix the Cat]

Blair and Hain face fierce backlash over amnesty for 150 IRA fugitives (http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/11/24/nulst24.xml)

Tony Blair and Peter Hain, the Northern Ireland Secretary, faced a fierce and emotional backlash from MPs yesterday over legislation to allow fugitive terrorists to return without having to serve prison sentences.

The Bill will allow those wanted by police for some of the most heinous atrocities during the IRA's 30-year campaign to have their slate effectively wiped clean.

Mr Hain looked lonely and uncomfortable as he faced a series of highly emotional interventions from MPs, including the Rev William McCrea (DUP Antrim S) who described seeing his two young cousins after they had been blown up by the IRA.

He faced angry protests from Tory MPs when he disclosed that members of the security forces, including serving British soldiers, would also be able to take advantage of the new procedure.

Iain Duncan Smith, the former Conservative leader, who served with the Army in Northern Ireland, accused the Government of using the inclusion of British soldiers in the procedures as a "shield" for a "grubby and reprehensible" piece of legislation.

The Conservatives, Liberal Democrats and all the Northern Ireland political parties apart from Sinn Fein, the political wing of the IRA, served notice that they opposed the Bill.

During the debate Mr Hain acknowledged that the agreement to provide an effective amnesty for "on-the-run" terrorists was necessary to ensure that the IRA gave up violence, even though Sinn Fein had given a commitment to exclusively democratic and peaceful means when it signed the Good Friday Agreement in 1998.

Earlier, at Prime Minister's questions Mr Blair, who yesterday met the widows of murdered RUC officers, admitted the legislation would cause "pain and anguish" to victims, but said it was vital to the Northern Ireland peace process. He faced criticism from one Unionist MP who compared the actions with offering an amnesty to those who shot Pc Sharon Beshenivsky in Bradford on Friday.

"What would the British people think of you if you offered an amnesty to the murderer of the police officer?" asked David Simpson (DUP Upper Bann).

Mr Hain insisted that the Northern Ireland (Offences) Bill was necessary to bring closure to the IRA's "awful and murderous" campaign.

It would at least ensure that terrorists, some of whom had been on the run for decades, would get a criminal record, he said.

The amnesty would apply to up to 150 people wanted by police for offences committed before the Good Friday Agreement was signed in 1998. Paramilitary figures who returned would have their cases heard by a special tribunal - not the normal courts.

They would not have to appear in person, but if they were convicted, they would have a criminal record, be required to give DNA and fingerprints, and could be subject to recall to prison for their crimes if they broke the conditions imposed on them.

Mr Hain said the procedure would "bring closure" and ensure that the IRA's armed campaign was over.

At present, people on the run were outside UK jurisdiction, and the fact they would get a criminal record if the tribunal convicted them, "ought to be some comfort to the victims concerned".

But faced with accusations that the Bill was "insulting" to victims, Mr Hain conceded: "The legislation is hated by victims".

A procession of MPs from all parties rose to condemn the legislation, which they claimed was part of a "secret stitch-up" between Mr Blair and the IRA leadership.

A Conservative attempt to block the Bill's Commons second reading was rejected by 313 to 258, a majority of 55. The Bill's second reading was then approved by 310 to 262, a margin of 48.

In Northern Ireland, victims of the Troubles accused the Government of hypocrisy over its handling of terrorism.

Aileen Quinton, who lost her mother Alberta, 71, in the 1987 Enniskillen Poppy Day massacre, described the Bill as an "absolute disgrace".

The terrorists behind the IRA bombing, which killed 11 people, are believed to be among around 150 people able to take advantage of the legislation.

Miss Quinton said that the Government was guilty of double standards when the Northern Ireland situation was compared with the anti-terrorism measures introduced following the London bombings.

"It seems my mother was murdered by cuddly terrorists and not the bad terrorists," she said.

[Jonathan]

This Bill also provides amnesty for Loyalists too.

[Jonathan]

Sinn Féin have now pulled a U-Turn and are against the Bill.

[Felix the Cat]

Sinn Fein rejects on-the-run bill (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/4546648.stm)

Sinn Fein has rejected new legislation which is supposed to give so-called "on-the-run" republicans an amnesty.

Party vice-president Pat Doherty said the legislation was "far removed" from what had been agreed during 2001 talks with the government at Weston Park.

He also accused the government of "sleight of hand" in that the law would grant amnesty to security forces who committed murder during the Troubles.

But the government said there was no other vehicle for dealing with OTRs.

A Northern Ireland Office spokesman said Sinn Fein were "deluding themselves", if they thought that there was.

Mr Doherty met Northern Ireland Secretary Peter Hain at Stormont on Tuesday and urged him to withdraw the legislation.

"We are now calling for it (the legislation) to be rejected and we are withdrawing from anything to do with it," he said.

Advice

Mr Doherty said Sinn Fein would also be advising republicans "on the run" not to seek registration under the legislation should it go through.

The plans cover up to 150 people wanted for crimes committed before 1998.

They would have their cases heard by a special tribunal and, if found guilty, would be freed on licence without having to go to jail.

Mr Doherty led a delegation of party members and victims' groups to meet Mr Hain on Tuesday to give their views on the Northern Ireland (Offences) Bill which is currently going through Parliament.

Sinn Fein initially welcomed it, but now realise it will not only give an amnesty to IRA members but also to any soldiers or police officers who committed murder during 30 years of violence.

Urging the government to scrap the legislation and "stick to what was agreed", Mr Doherty said: "There are no British ground forces on the run.

"It was sleight of hand and inexcusable to bring that aspect into the legislation. It was not agreed at Weston Park. And it is not acceptable and needs to be rejected."

Mr Doherty said Sinn Fein had been in contact with many of those "on the run" before making the decision to reject the legislation.

The SDLP also met the government on Tuesday.

Since the Northern Ireland Offences Bill was published in November, the party has been criticising Sinn Fein over the issue of collusion.

The SDLP leader, Mark Durkan, claimed what he called "an alliance of sleaze" had been formed between republicans and the British.

The Ulster Unionist leader, Sir Reg Empey, said the legislation "should be scrapped", but warned that government must not enter into any future negotiation with republicans which might result in "even worse legislation".

"This distasteful, side deal which should never have seen the light of day in the first place must now be consigned to the dustbin where it belongs, never to be resurrected," he said.

Two stages

The proposed law would set up a two-stage process. First someone who will be known as the certification officer will decide if someone is eligible for the scheme.

This could be a paramilitary on-the-run, someone living in Northern Ireland who is charged with an offence before 1998 or a member of the security forces accused of an offence committed when they were combating terrorism.

The case would then go to a special tribunal, consisting of a retired judge sitting without a jury. The tribunal would have all the normal powers of the Crown Court but accused would not have to appear for their trial.

If found guilty they would get a criminal record but would be freed on licence. They would have to provide fingerprints and DNA samples to be granted their licence.

The scheme will be temporary but a precise cut-off period is not specified in the bill - instead its expiry is linked to the lifetime of the chief constable's historic cases review team, which is looking at unsolved murders during the Troubles.

[Felix the Cat]

'Fugitive bill must be scrapped' (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/4547900.stm)

The government should scrap the "on-the-run" legislation and not agree to any Sinn Fein proposed changes, the Ulster Unionist Party has said.

Sinn Fein wants the bill scrapped after saying that allowing anyone involved in Troubles-related crime to avoid prison was not what they had agreed.

But UUP leader Sir Reg Empey said he did not want "any more meddling".

The Northern Ireland Office has said there is no other vehicle for dealing with the "on-the-run" issue.

On Tuesday, Sinn Fein vice-president Pat Doherty said the legislation was "far removed" from what had been agreed during 2001 talks with the government at Weston Park.

He also accused the government of "sleight of hand" in that the law would grant amnesty to security forces who committed murder during the Troubles.

However, a Northern Ireland Office spokesman said Sinn Fein were "deluding themselves", if they thought that there was an alternative to the bill.

Mr Doherty met Northern Ireland Secretary Peter Hain at Stormont on Tuesday and urged him to withdraw the legislation.

"We are now calling for it (the legislation) to be rejected and we are withdrawing from anything to do with it," he said.

Advice

Mr Doherty said Sinn Fein would also be advising republicans "on the run" not to seek registration under the legislation should it go through.

The plans cover up to 150 people wanted for crimes committed before 1998.

They would have their cases heard by a special tribunal and, if found guilty, would be freed on licence without having to go to jail.

Mr Doherty led a delegation of party members and victims' groups to meet Mr Hain on Tuesday to give their views on the Northern Ireland (Offences) Bill which is currently going through Parliament.

Sinn Fein initially welcomed it, but now realise it will not only give an amnesty to IRA members but also to any soldiers or police officers who committed murder during 30 years of violence.

DUP deputy leader Peter Robinson said there was now no reason for the government to proceed with the "obnoxious and obscene" bill.

"Democratic representatives from Northern Ireland who sat on the committee scrutinising the on-the-run bill have been completely united in their opposition to this judicial farce," he said.

"Now is the time to scrap this sickening legislation and for the government to make sure it never again gets into such a mess," he said.

Sir Reg said: "The legislation should indeed be scrapped, but government must not enter into any future negotiation with republicans that will result in even worse legislation.

"This distasteful side-deal which should never have seen the light of day in the first place must now be consigned to the dustbin where it belongs, never to be resurrected."

Conservative NI spokesman David Liddington said he believed the government was "stuck" with the bill.

"I hope they will think again. They have given some indications that they are prepared to look at amendments to this bill as it continues through Parliament," he told BBC News on Wednesday.

Two stages

The Police Federation for Northern Ireland urged the prime minister to "take Sinn Fein at its word" and withdraw the legislation.

Federation Chairman Irwin Montgomery said: "Now is the opportunity to do the right thing - even if it is for the wrong reason of Sinn Fein hypocrisy in not wanting the legislation to apply to military or police personnel.

Withdrawing the legislation will also preserve the integrity of the historic case review process. I urge this government to do the decent thing and abandon the bill."

The proposed law would set up a two-stage process. First someone who will be known as the certification officer will decide if someone is eligible for the scheme.

This could be a paramilitary on-the-run, someone living in Northern Ireland who is charged with an offence before 1998 or a member of the security forces accused of an offence committed when they were combating terrorism.

The case would then go to a special tribunal, consisting of a retired judge sitting without a jury. The tribunal would have all the normal powers of the Crown Court but accused would not have to appear for their trial.

If found guilty they would get a criminal record but would be freed on licence. They would have to provide fingerprints and DNA samples to be granted their licence.

The scheme will be temporary but a precise cut-off period is not specified in the bill - instead its expiry is linked to the lifetime of the chief constable's historic cases review team, which is looking at unsolved murders during the Troubles.

[Felix the Cat]

British govt withdraws 'on the runs' bill (http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0111/north.html)

The British government has withdrawn the bill currently going through the Westminster parliament on so-called 'on the runs'.

The bill would have granted a virtual amnesty to fugitive paramilitaries and current and former members of the security forces involved in terrorist-related offences.

In a statement in the House of Commons, the Northern Secretary, Peter Hain, said the British government would review the position in the autumn and would be mindful of the views of the parties.

However, he said the British government remained of the view that the anomaly of the so-called 'on the runs', who would have qualified for the early release scheme if they had been in jail at the time of the agreement, would need to be faced at some point if Northern Ireland was to move forward.

The British government had been condemned by all parties in the House of Commons over the legislation.

Under the proposals, fugitive paramilitaries who had committed a scheduled offence before the Good Friday Agreement would be able to apply to be dealt with by a special tribunal.

They would not have to appear before that tribunal and would be immediately released on licence.

Sinn Féin had also opposed the legislation because it would be available to members of the security forces.

[Jonathan]

The Scheme has been scraped.

[Jonathan]

I also see Sinn Féin have done away with their Far-Left economic policy. They must be trying to expand into the Middle-Class votes. This will make it difficult with the European Parliamentary allies, but overall an astute/opertunistic political move/sell-out.

[Jonathan]

Meursault, I got your PM. Due to a glitch in the Phora http://www.thephora.net/forum/showthread.php?t=3068 the posts you made were deleted(along with all other posts made 28 hours before the glitch). I had replied to your posts too, but this has also been deleted. Don't worry, nobody was intentionally deleting your posts. My reply was that Gadafi supplied the IRA with weapons in the 70s. The IRA got a huge membership boost in the 70s after the British army shot dead a number of Civil Rights protestors. Sinn Féin have ditched their economic policy because they are gaining ground in the Republic of Ireland(politically, their vote has increased). The new policy will be used to expand into the middle-class votes.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

[cerberus]

CAB are really turning the screw on our "Egyptian Loyalist" what is it £800,000 and he can give no proof of income.

[Jonathan]

CAB are really turning the screw on our "Egyptian Loyalist" what is it £800,000 and he can give no proof of income.
Holy Jesus, long time no see Cerberus.:)

[cerberus]

Yes Shane , its been a while- didn't know Phora was still active - found it again quite by accident.:)

The " fugitives" issue is a "catch 22" it really is. Whilst we have a situation which is little more than a half way house between an uneasy peace and " the troubles" there is a lot of raw and unexpressed anger on both sides which will not be worked through for some considerable time.
There are people who have only empty chairs and graves to visit who percieve that the peace process is a one way street and will look on this as being proof of this.

No one in their right mind wants to set the clock back and the only thing we can be sure of is the uncomfortable journey this will be for all of us.
It is very easy for politicians to ask for "confidence building measures" but when one man's " measure" is another man's "insult" its complicated to say the least.

[Jonathan]

Welcome back all the same.

What do you make of Sinn Féin gains down south? Are you in DNE or DSW btw?

[cerberus]

Shane I don't know a great deal about politics of "the south".
SF are a party which are not going to go away , they are a major power broker in the "North" .(Unfortunately the middle ground has desintergrated to a large extent, you now have DUP and SF being the "major share holders").

As far as SF gains in the "South" they are no doubt interested in becoming a major player within Ireland as a whole I don't think they make any bones about it.
More seats mean the chance to influence and shape the goverment policy towards the North must be within their reasoning.
What do folks in the "South" think ?
To me they have baggage which they have to put down , I guess I just don't like politics outside of the middle ground.

[Jonathan]

SF are a party which are not going to go away , they are a major power broker in the "North" .(Unfortunately the middle ground has desintergrated to a large extent, you now have DUP and SF being the "major share holders").
I was at a talk given by Austin Curry a few months ago, he maintained that Paisley would go into proper talks because he bases his whole image on being "radical" and "on the fringe". Curry claims that if Paisley entered proper talks, his core supporters would become disolusioned! Food for thought.

What do folks in the "South" think ?
It depends who you ask I suppose. Most of their gains have been in socio-economically disadvantaged black-spots in towns/cities i.e. people who have no more faith in the main parties. They also gained alot of support for their involvement in the Rossport 5 issue. Also, when the Irish Ferries workers were protesting at the "race to the bottom" Sinn Féin were right in their when the mainstream parties were sitting on the fence. If you look at the last local elections in Ireland(where Sinn Féin got major gains) you will see that alot of people voted Sinn Féin but also voted "Yes" in the citizenship referendum, even though Sinn Fein had campagned for a "No" vote i.e. People who voted Sinn Féin mightn't necessarily agree with all Sinn Féin policy ironically. Personally, I don't think their vote will move out of that group, but with this new economic policy, it is clear that they intend to expand into the middle-classes. Mary Lou MacDonald is herself from Foxrock, wealthy-Dublin (ironically, Mary Lou was originally in Fianna Fáil but failed in the party conventions before switching to Sinn Féin!).

To me they have baggage which they have to put down , I guess I just don't like politics outside of the middle ground.
Well, the fact that they don't recognise the legitimacy of Dáil Eireann, An Gárda Síochána, or the Army in the 1st place is a problem. The MacCartney sisters, the Columbia 3, Garda Gerry MacCabe, Frank Connolly etc etc all blotches on the Sinn Féin book.

[cerberus]

I saw a news iem in Saturdays Irish News , the writer thought that SF gains might have reached a high water mark.
Proof of pudding is how they represent people and how this rates beside the more estiblished parties.
I wonder how the middle classes will square with the idea of a "socialist Ireland" .
As far as they go in the North , in fact all plitical parties go it would be nice to see the "traditional party politics" taking a back seat to real issues.
Sf are saying no to water charges which will give each household a£400 bill *per year. *approx.).
All the oter s are doing like wise , a bit of unity on the matter would be a good idea , this " we don't talk to them but we are prepared to talk in their general direction" approach seems a bit naff.
I do agree on the Rev. Ian - he is a victim of his own image - if he talks or is seen to be "soft" , I wonder who his "disaffected voters" might vote for , not the UUP ?:confused: ;)

Politics here are moving into uncharted waters - change is an uncertain storm to have to weather.