Fascism and class divisions

[Thomas777]

From a philisophical/theoretical perspective (not an actual/practical standpoint), how does Fascism treat class disparities and traditional notions of aristocracy?

This has been a subject of much debate. Many Marxists claim that Fascism is merely a militaristic, aggressive form of pure capitalism...many liberals and free marketeers claim that Fascism constitutes an extreme form of protectionism or merely a variant of socialism.

Please share your thoughts on this.

[Hakluyt]

Some aristocrats and some bourgeois capitalists support[ed] it as a means to control the low classes - culturally and economically, respectively - but both were deeply mistaken as to its usefulness.

It is a thoroughly proletarian and massified form of governance, and can yield nothing but base leadership and an intensifying need to appease. It was a complete sellout on the part of the aristocrats who supported it (though by no means did the majority of them do so). It distorts organic culture in favour of a state-mediated 'culture' of the lowest common denominator which, in turn, serves its perpetual need to promote greater degrees of illusory 'unity', its power mechanism. It is anti-kultur without question.

In these terms it's no better than democracy. Its tendency toward economic socialism is its only side benefit (admittedly a signifcant one when contrasted with a purely capitalist system, but most democracies are not purely capitalist).

[WFHermans]

From the little bit I read of fascist source documents I gather that fascism softened the class distinctions from capitalism.

[Ahknaton]

Fascism aimed to reconcile class differences by rallying the masses around a national identity and promoting partnership between the state and private industry, with the state acting as guarantor of worker's rights. The degree to which this was achieved is debateable, but it can be pointed out that Germans Workers enjoyed some of the highest wages in Europe at the end of the 1930s (a fact that was capitalised upon by Axis propagandists in leaflet drops aimed at Allied soldiers). Admittedly Naziism is not quite the same beast as Fascism, but the origins of Italian Fascism in leftist workers movements is well-known (Mussolini started off as a leftist).

Anti-fascists are acutely aware of the potential for fascist ideology to neutralise class conflict, hence their slogans "No war but class war" and "The Working class has no nation".

[Vindex]

I think it depends on the spirit of the people with the power, today the class rift is very real and class warfare is the normal with the plutocrat class seeking the creation of a boarderless global feudal wage serf domain. Hence one of the big reasons why they push race mixing and universalism.

[Blighter]

From a philisophical/theoretical perspective (not an actual/practical standpoint), how does Fascism treat class disparities and traditional notions of aristocracy?

This has been a subject of much debate. Many Marxists claim that Fascism is merely a militaristic, aggressive form of pure capitalism...many liberals and free marketeers claim that Fascism constitutes an extreme form of protectionism or merely a variant of socialism.

Please share your thoughts on this.

...

8. How are you going to break down the barriers of class ?
By establishment of the principle of no reward without service, and the consequent elimination of the parasite who creates the barrier of social class. Functional differences will exist according to difference of function, but differences of social classes will be eliminated. They arise from the fact that in present society the few can live in idleness as a master class upon the production of the many. Under Fascism all will serve in varying manner and degree the nation to which all are responsible.
This present conception of divided social classes invades even productive spheres. With the abolition of a parasitic cUss by our proposals fot dealing with hereditary wealth, this tendency too, will be eliminated. The Managing Director of a business will perform a different function from that which the Charwoman performs in sweeping out his office. But the difference will be functional and not social. Outside the difference of function and of service the Fascist State recognises no difference between its citizens. The lecognition of functional differences, however, marks another difference between Fascism and Socialism. The equalitarian doctrines of the latter, which are not only social but functional, lead logically to the performance of the Managing Director's function by a committee of Charwomen.
We believe everywhere in the Leadership principle and the functional differentiation which allocates definite responsibility to the individual. This principle rests on an obvious fact of human nature which Socialism ignores. Men and women are born with varying gifts and capacities.



35. What is the difference between Fascism and Capitalism, since both admit the system of private enterprise?
In brief definition, Capitalism is the system by which capital uses the Nation for its own purposes. Fascism is the system by which the Nation uses capital for its own purposes. Private enterprise is permitted and encouraged so long as it coincides with the national interests. Private enterprise is not permitted when it conflicts with national interests. Under Fascism private enterprise may serve but not exploit. This is secured by the Corporative System, which lays down the limits within which industry may operate, and those limits are the welfare of the Nation.

http://oswaldmosley.com/downloads/100%20Questions.lit

[themistocles]

Fascism aimed to reconcile class differences by rallying the masses around a national identity and promoting partnership between the state and private industry, with the state acting as guarantor of worker's rights.

That's how I understand it. I'd say the above quote could well serve as the definition of fascism's take on class.

[Daniel Shays]

Fascist societies depend on youth organizations to recognize natural leaders, who would then be encouraged to develop those leadership qualities and ultimately take high ranking positions in the party and corporations. Hence, Fascism destroys arbitrary social classes and creates a new kind of hierarchy based on demonstrated ability or achievement.

[Petr]

Fascist societies depend on youth organizations to recognize natural leaders, who would then be encouraged to develop those leadership qualities and ultimately take high ranking positions in the party and corporations. Hence, Fascism destroys arbitrary social classes and creates a new kind of hierarchy based on demonstrated ability or achievement.
So, to put it succinctly, it is statist meritocracy. A bit like Confucian scholars were manufactured as loyal servants of the Chinese empire for many, many centuries.


Petr

[Leif]

This has been a subject of much debate. Many Marxists claim that Fascism is merely a militaristic, aggressive form of pure capitalism...many liberals and free marketeers claim that Fascism constitutes an extreme form of protectionism or merely a variant of socialism.

Even if in theory the Fascists were anti-capitalist due to its private ownership and lack of national orientation, Fascist actions served only to help capitalism by destroying its oldest enemies (socialists) and launching a war in which millions of European workers were killed. They also seemed to have operated under the false idea that class conflict could be mediated. Class struggle is ultimately the domination of the workers or destruction of the capitalists. (I will explain my reasoning for this if so desired.)

[Kodos]

Even if in theory the Fascists were anti-capitalist due to its private ownership and lack of national orientation, Fascist actions served only to help capitalism by destroying its oldest enemies (socialists)

American lend lease built the basketcase of the Soviet Union, which prior could not even defeat Finland, into a world power.

[WFHermans]

The Soviet Union did defeat Finland and did that faster and more efficiently than the USA defeated Iraq.

About the theoretical side of fascism I know nothing. I always study source material if I want to know about a subject and if I were to study fascism I would read the theory written by fascists itself, not some Wikipedophile article about fascism. Some of Mussolini's work has been translated but I didn't read that yet.

There is an interesting practical example of class distinction in the fascist state. When Hitler visited Italy, he was shocked that Mussolini's wife had to stand at the back, behind all the dukes and barons.

[Kodos]

The Soviet Union did defeat Finland and did that faster and more efficiently than the USA defeated Iraq.

In 1940???

[Leif]

American lend lease built the basketcase of the Soviet Union, which prior could not even defeat Finland, into a world power.

Check the WW2 Logitistics thread in the Socialist Paradise.

The Soviet Union had incredible productive powers.

And yes, they did defeat Finland. The USSR and Finland went to war over the USSR being able to establish military bases on Finnish territory. The USSR achieved its goal during the war. I believe they considered taking the entire country, but the losses proved too great for that and they settled for the original demands.